GUNTHER Dismisses Notion That WWE's Imperium Gimmick Has Anything Do To With Fascism

The discourse surrounding whether or not GUNTHER and the Imperium gimmick present as, at least, broadly fascistic was reignited last week when GUNTHER's overall rating in the "WWE 2K23" video game was announced as 88. That number is commonly used as a white supremacist dog whistle for "heil Hitler." It was quickly changed after GUNTHER protested, albeit on the grounds that he deserved a higher rating.

This latest incident returned the discourse to where it was when it seemed that WWE initially named GUNTHER after Nazi submarine commander Gunther Stark. Perhaps in light of this, when GUNTHER appeared on The Ringer's "Cheap Heat" podcast that dropped Friday, host Peter Rosenberg asked the WWE Intercontinental Champion how he felt about the associated stigma as an Austrian who was based out of Germany until recently.

"Obviously, like you mention it, that's the history of the two countries," GUNTHER replied "That's something we can never change. We have to live with it. But obviously, that's something that got thrown at us before and still gets thrown at us. We don't really acknowledge it because it's so far away from what the truth is, and often, I also blame it on people ... see[ing] the first, obvious thing and jump[ing] on it. It doesn't represent the culture in our countries, either. Austria and Germany have made huge efforts to be hard on themselves when it comes to their history and keep themselves in check."

"It's something I think everyone from there, and when I talk with [Ludwig] Kaiser that's one of the things we're most proud about when it comes to our cultures," GUNTHER continued. "There's no nice talking about stuff like that, and people who try? They get run over right away. There's no way to justify any of that. I think we shouldn't mix up ideologies and stylistics if that makes sense. Everything we want to be is far away from that."

Rosenberg added that he felt that one of the things that enhances the presentation of Imperium is how serious they are and how it comes off as genuine without winking at the audience. GUNTHER agreed before diving into the significance of that.

"We mean it!" he said. "We build our livelihood around it. Why should we not take it seriously? There's no playing a character or anything like that. That's just what we are and we express it, obviously, in a more extravagant way in the ring. But I think that's why it works. And we thought about it years ago, when we took that as our identity. That's who we are. Just let it all out in the ring, and it's gonna be authentic."

In light of that, Rosenberg asked GUNTHER if he'd be willing to try out a lighter version of Imperium down the road, and the former WALTER was not opposed to that.

"We did before, in different places, not that big of a stage obviously, and if it comes natural, it's definitely possible. I think a lot of people can relate to us and can connect to us. [For our entrance,] it's usually the blackout, the music hits, people get excited, and they cheer for a second. But then the light goes on and then everybody goes, 'Aww.' I think that's a great sign that also shows that deep down. they must respect us and appreciate what we do in the ring."

GUNTHER has been WWE Intercontinental Champion since defeating Ricochet on June 10. Since then, he's had notable title defenses against the likes of Sheamus, Braun Strowman, and Rey Mysterio, and is in the midst of the title's longest reign of the 2000s.

If you use any of the quotes in this article, please credit "Cheap Heat" with an h/t to Wrestling Inc. for the transcription.